IRC office hours/Office hours 2009-10-29

[2009-10-29 08:59:52] <cary> Okay, good morning everyone!

[2009-10-29 08:59:59] * DarkoNeko waves

[2009-10-29 08:59:59] <cary> =========

[2009-10-29 09:00:05] <cary> This channel is logged.

[2009-10-29 09:00:11] <kwadhwa> bom dia!

[2009-10-29 09:00:18] <cary> Welcome everyone to today's office hours

[2009-10-29 09:01:00] <dungodung> hello :)

[2009-10-29 09:01:24] <peteforsyth> thanks cary

[2009-10-29 09:01:25] <cary> Today's guest is Kul Wadhwa

[2009-10-29 09:01:39] <cary> The head of business development for the Wikimedia Foundation

[2009-10-29 09:01:59] <cary> I'll be moderating but I've asked dungodung to help out in case I pass out or die or something

[2009-10-29 09:02:07] <kwadhwa> good call

[2009-10-29 09:02:17] <dungodung> we sure hope it won't come to that :)

[2009-10-29 09:02:18] <cary> kwadhwa is taking questions from everyone

[2009-10-29 09:02:29] <kwadhwa> except the mafia

[2009-10-29 09:02:35] <cary> Please preface questions with question (like so:)

[2009-10-29 09:02:46] * Jeromyu waves

[2009-10-29 09:02:49] <cary> QUESTION: Kul, I heard you speak Japanese, can you share with us?

[2009-10-29 09:03:00] <kwadhwa> hi

[2009-10-29 09:03:09] <kwadhwa> genki desu ka?

[2009-10-29 09:03:28] <kwadhwa> and that's how I can answer

[2009-10-29 09:03:28] <Jeromyu> komichiwa LOL

[2009-10-29 09:03:30] <DarkoNeko> ma ne

[2009-10-29 09:04:05] <Jeromyu> should say Ohayo in SF LOL

[2009-10-29 09:04:36] <cary> So don't be shy.

[2009-10-29 09:04:37] <kwadhwa> it's konbanwa for Jerry

[2009-10-29 09:04:47] <cary> or we can sit and chat the entire time.

[2009-10-29 09:05:08] <Jeromyu> who will be in Paris next week?

[2009-10-29 09:05:15] <kwadhwa> me

[2009-10-29 09:05:37] <kwadhwa> for other reasons but I will try to stop by

[2009-10-29 09:05:42] * DarkoNeko is in paris most of the time?

[2009-10-29 09:07:00] <cary> les francophones (il y a beaucoup je croix), si vous avez besoin mettre tes questions en francais, on peux traduire

[2009-10-29 09:07:24] <Amgine> Since it's awfully quiet: QUESTION: How would you describe your job, Kul?

[2009-10-29 09:07:26] <DarkoNeko> can we write them in japanese too ?

[2009-10-29 09:07:32] <cary> DarkoNeko: hai

[2009-10-29 09:07:38] <DarkoNeko> yatta !

[2009-10-29 09:07:44] <Jeromyu> chinois, si vous plait? LOL

[2009-10-29 09:07:53] <DarkoNeko> t'es pas drole.

[2009-10-29 09:08:03] <cary> even portuguese :)

[2009-10-29 09:08:15] <cary> Good question, Amgine

[2009-10-29 09:08:16] <cary> Kul:

[2009-10-29 09:08:17] <cary> ?

[2009-10-29 09:08:28] <kwadhwa> hmm...interesting question. Instead of just biz dev, I see it as finding creative ways to bring in revenue that support the mission but also help us strategically

[2009-10-29 09:09:19] <Amgine> Question: Can you define our strategy, as regards this?

[2009-10-29 09:09:31] <kwadhwa> biz dev actually means different things to different people, organizations, companies

[2009-10-29 09:10:32] <kwadhwa> I have three main criteria when I evaluate opportunities: 1) strategic fit; 2) mission benefits; 3) revenue potential

[2009-10-29 09:10:55] <kwadhwa> the third is obviously the easiest to model out so it's half art and half science

[2009-10-29 09:11:15] <kwadhwa> I'll give you a specific example...

[2009-10-29 09:11:31] * Jeromyu goes to shower ttyl

[2009-10-29 09:11:41] <kwadhwa> make sure you use soap

[2009-10-29 09:11:48] <kwadhwa> :)

[2009-10-29 09:12:04] <kwadhwa> mobile partnerships are extremely important for us

[2009-10-29 09:12:07] <cary> good follow-up question, Amgine

[2009-10-29 09:12:36] <kwadhwa> it's a very fragmented market and there's no way we can hire or manage hundreds or thousands of developers ourselves

[2009-10-29 09:12:59] <kwadhwa> but the projects need to be available on these platforms

[2009-10-29 09:13:32] <kwadhwa> we also need to leverage parties out there that can develop cool applications in this space

[2009-10-29 09:14:02] <kwadhwa> therefore...this area clearly fits both mission and strategic objectives

[2009-10-29 09:14:11] <kwadhwa> and then I try to find the revenue piece

[2009-10-29 09:14:27] <pm75> QUESTION: I heard you were about to make some deal with Kingstown to sell usb keys, could you tell us more about it ?

[2009-10-29 09:14:56] <kwadhwa> Yes, we are in discussion with them on it right now

[2009-10-29 09:16:06] <kwadhwa> just to give you some background, I had discussions with several of the top memory companies (just to do my due diligence) which includes Sandisk, Samsung, Hitachi, etc.

[2009-10-29 09:16:46] <pm75> but do you have any idea about the offline reader ?

[2009-10-29 09:16:58] <kwadhwa> about getting Wikimedia content on their devices as a valued added feature in developed countries and then, hopefully, as a needed content distribution device in developing countries

[2009-10-29 09:17:02] <Betacommand> QUESTION:what will the deal be about?

[2009-10-29 09:17:15] <cary> Betacommand: can you be more specific?

[2009-10-29 09:17:20] <cary> even if this is a follow up.

[2009-10-29 09:17:23] <Betacommand> cary: nevermind

[2009-10-29 09:17:44] <Betacommand> kwadhwa: second line answered it

[2009-10-29 09:17:44] <kwadhwa> we are not exactly sure yet but we are hoping to create a low cost device to start out with that has offline content on it that can be distributed all over the world

[2009-10-29 09:18:26] <Ziko> Question: In Open Software companies, they say that they do not live from selling software but from providing support. Kul, would you say that that is the same as for WMF?

[2009-10-29 09:18:51] <kwadhwa> Kingston was willing to do be very flexible on how we do this since they are a private company. All the other companies have to model out ops within their existing business units, which is a hard sell for us

[2009-10-29 09:19:27] <kwadhwa> For Open Software companies, that is true, but it's not for us

[2009-10-29 09:20:14] <kwadhwa> providing support is almost like consulting. it requires a lot of staff/employees to do this and we don't have those resources

[2009-10-29 09:20:44] <kwadhwa> we can only provide minimal support at this time

[2009-10-29 09:20:47] <Ziko> I just reread what was said about the WMF-Orange deal. That Orange is free to use our content anyway but that Orange wishes to use the logo and also get technical and other support from WMF

[2009-10-29 09:21:18] <Ziko> And I am also curious what would be that support for Orange

[2009-10-29 09:21:24] <kwadhwa> yes, we provide basic support but they know we can only do so much

[2009-10-29 09:22:59] <kwadhwa> for example, Brion was helping them with integration questions at the time and Jay and I were helping them on branding, content, licensing, etc. but our time is extremely limited. Other companies would have dedicated staff to do this but we're a non-profit so we have to do multiple duties

[2009-10-29 09:23:06] =-= Jamesofur|sleep is now known as Jamesofur

[2009-10-29 09:23:26] <pm75> QUESTION: how about using the Okawix offline reader, which is free software and portable in order to lessen the developpement costs ?

[2009-10-29 09:24:29] <kwadhwa> we talked about that and Tomasz (do you know Tomasz Finc...he has being doing a lot of research into the technical aspects of the offline reader from the foundation side) looked into it

[2009-10-29 09:24:40] <kwadhwa> and we continually keep our options open

[2009-10-29 09:24:53] <kwadhwa> however, our main concern is the product development cycle has been too long

[2009-10-29 09:25:18] <kwadhwa> and we needed to show proof-of-concept to Kingston right away

[2009-10-29 09:27:17] <kwadhwa> therefore, acting as a product manager, I tried to piece a demo product and we were able to get the parties together and go from concept to test product in three weeks. That really impressed Kingston and showed we could execute. They already have retail stores interested in distributing the next version as a test. They also told me that Unesco and Universities in India are also interested

[2009-10-29 09:28:00] <kwadhwa> Having their credibility behind it is important since they are the largest manufacturer of USB devices in the world...with global distribution

[2009-10-29 09:28:37] <kwadhwa> but this doesn't limit other products. we want to see more

[2009-10-29 09:28:51] <kwadhwa> anything that supports the mission in a positive way

[2009-10-29 09:31:06] <kwadhwa> does that answer your question?

[2009-10-29 09:32:15] * Jeromyu is back with my iced tea in Taiwanese style, and we no longer soap for shower here, body wash instead

[2009-10-29 09:32:28] <pm75> yes kwadhwa

[2009-10-29 09:32:39] <qp_pq> hey all

[2009-10-29 09:32:44] <Jeromyu> hi

[2009-10-29 09:32:44] <kwadhwa> Jeremy: is that the tea with the tapioca balls?

[2009-10-29 09:32:54] <Jeromyu> bingo!

[2009-10-29 09:33:06] <kwadhwa> nice

[2009-10-29 09:33:17] <kwadhwa> pm75: great

[2009-10-29 09:33:27] <qp_pq> tapioca balls ?

[2009-10-29 09:33:43] <Jeromyu> I dunno why it suddenly become a hit in Hong Kong, while I was in the Americas

[2009-10-29 09:34:02] <kwadhwa> nobody has asked me about Wikipedia underwear of cereal ;)

[2009-10-29 09:34:03] <cary> bubble tea

[2009-10-29 09:34:05] <bodnotbod_> QUESTION: Could we get tapioca balls branded with the Wikipedia globe?

[2009-10-29 09:34:13] <kwadhwa> or cereal

[2009-10-29 09:34:19] <Amgine> QUESTION: How does the WikiReader tail into the fundraising side of WMF?

[2009-10-29 09:34:28] <kwadhwa> do they have white ones?

[2009-10-29 09:34:48] <kwadhwa> you mean the device that's out there created by a third party?

[2009-10-29 09:35:18] <kwadhwa> this one? http://thewikireader.com/

[2009-10-29 09:35:34] <Amgine> Yes.

[2009-10-29 09:36:11] <Ziko> Question: Kul, what do you think about the possible success of the wikireader?

[2009-10-29 09:36:12] <Jeromyu> I remember somewhere in Taiwan have the white tapioca balls

[2009-10-29 09:36:13] <kwadhwa> Honestly, I'm not exactly sure. You can obviously see the support message on their site and it's good to see the content in more places

[2009-10-29 09:36:18] <Jeromyu> http://f23.yahoofs.com/myper/XYfRxGLERtydzTk0bE6ow--/blog/ap_F23_20091013111137717.jpg?TTA436KBBBGBanxU

[2009-10-29 09:36:50] <Jeromyu> a bit yellowish in fact :P

[2009-10-29 09:36:54] <kwadhwa> If I am being brutally honest, it's going to be difficult to be successful IF you measure by number of units sold, profitability in this case

[2009-10-29 09:37:38] <Ziko> i wonder about the target groups

[2009-10-29 09:37:46] <kwadhwa> It is a first version though...but the product needs to improve. And the price point is quite high...but I think everyone knows that

[2009-10-29 09:37:46] <htchien> tapioca ball tea is good in Taiwan. :)

[2009-10-29 09:38:09] <Ziko> they say it is for children, but who gives his child a 99 $ device if he thinks that the child is too young for internet access

[2009-10-29 09:38:18] * Jeromyu waves at Ted

[2009-10-29 09:39:01] <kwadhwa> I'm not going to debate it with you since I don't disagree. I obviously want these people to be successful but I'm not going to bs you either

[2009-10-29 09:39:23] <htchien> hi Jeromyu :)

[2009-10-29 09:39:57] <Ziko> kul: I see the problem; we actually want to encourage those initiatives in future

[2009-10-29 09:40:24] <Ziko> but a usb stick would be much cheaper

[2009-10-29 09:40:24] <kwadhwa> Jeromyu has volunteered to put the Wikipedia puzzle globe on white tapioca balls...all by hand

[2009-10-29 09:40:26] <htchien> I believe there will be a cheaper version of Wiki reading device in the near future....

[2009-10-29 09:40:35] <kwadhwa> you have to start somewhere

[2009-10-29 09:41:04] <Jeromyu> hey kwadhwa: , that's impossible

[2009-10-29 09:41:22] <kwadhwa> yes, let's say that you buy a USB device and you only have to pay one dollar more for the content...and it says "every purchase goes to support the projects," then you have a good value proposition

[2009-10-29 09:41:40] * htchien waves Jeromyu

[2009-10-29 09:42:17] <kwadhwa> and if we can show that people in the developed world would actually buy this, it get a lot easier for another foundation or NGO to buy a whole bunch of these and distribute them cheaply in developing countries where it would be more useful for them

[2009-10-29 09:42:48] <kwadhwa> hopefully we will see lots of stuff out there

[2009-10-29 09:43:38] <pm75> QUESTION: the company that develops Okawix was the editor of the first english wikipedia on CD, isn't it worthless for the WMF to have a parallel project on it ?

[2009-10-29 09:44:15] * Jeromyu finished his tea

[2009-10-29 09:44:20] <peteforsyth> QUESTION: how tightly integrated with the Wikipedia CD 1.0 wikiproject are such efforts?

[2009-10-29 09:44:25] <dami_hun_> question: how would these USB sticks work in the developed world with easy access to the net: wouldn't people just delete the content to get free space on their usb sticks...

[2009-10-29 09:44:54] <htchien> maybe to provide a wiki reader software for sell on e-book devices (the Amazon one) or mobile devices like iPhone / Android would be more realistic?

[2009-10-29 09:45:18] <cary> Kul, let's go with pm75's question while peteforsyth specifies what "such" means :)

[2009-10-29 09:45:26] <kwadhwa> pm75: I don't see why it would be worthless. Tom was trying to see what we could take from it or if we could use it

[2009-10-29 09:45:43] <nihiltres> htchien: there's already an iPhone app

[2009-10-29 09:46:14] <htchien> nihitres: thx, I know.

[2009-10-29 09:46:18] <kwadhwa> peteforsyth: ideally we would like to create a platform that you could take the content and put it and run it on any device. that's part of the Open Zim project

[2009-10-29 09:47:08] <peteforsyth> Kul, my question is about selecting content. Presumably any "offline" effort has to take only a limited selection of content, and there have to be judgments about how to select...

[2009-10-29 09:47:23] <peteforsyth> is the Wikipedia 1.0's effort the basis for that selection, or......?

[2009-10-29 09:47:25] <peteforsyth> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Version_1.0_Editorial_Team

[2009-10-29 09:47:51] <kwadhwa> htchien: we had talked to Amazon's Kindle team about what we could do in this area already but they are still exploring their options

[2009-10-29 09:48:47] <kwadhwa> the USB version we are working on with Kingston has all the content (but text only: rich media would be impossible for it to be cost effective)

[2009-10-29 09:48:57] <Amgine> QUESTION: due to the popularity of iPhone/iTouch and their growing storage capacities, is there any development on a wiki reader for that platform?

[2009-10-29 09:49:54] <peteforsyth> wow, I'm impressed. Thought there was way too much content to fit on a stick!

[2009-10-29 09:50:19] <kwadhwa> Amgine: someone has already developed an offline reader for the iPhone. I forgot the name of it but I can back to you about it. Since we don't have the bandwidth to do it...it's great to see other people are working on it

[2009-10-29 09:51:15] <nihiltres> kwadwha: I think the name was "Encyclopedia" IIRC

[2009-10-29 09:51:35] <kwadhwa> it's interesting though that there are a lot of questions about the offline reader and it shows you how many areas my job covers since I don't really look at this as a prime biz dev area as far as revenue is concerned

[2009-10-29 09:52:19] <peteforsyth> Question: can you talk about what different areas you're working on, then? You've mentioned offline readers and mobile partnerships...what else?

[2009-10-29 09:52:34] <Amgine> kwadhwa: with a dedicated offline reader dump system, you could (in theory) be using the distributed readers as a channel for fundraising advertisement.

[2009-10-29 09:52:38] <kwadhwa> for example, I am also part of the team that is trying to get our new data center funded primarily through corporate citizenship efforts and donations

[2009-10-29 09:52:45] <peteforsyth> (I think it's hard for a lot of us who don't have experience with biz dev on this level to wrap our heads around what you do)

[2009-10-29 09:52:54] <brianmc> Wouldn't the Wikipedia for schools project be a good base for some places?

[2009-10-29 09:53:04] <htchien> I remember the database for enwiki is about 4GB (text only, till 2007). I think it's capable to put the database on the USB device.

[2009-10-29 09:53:24] <kwadhwa> Amgine: we hope to have that as well. Right on

[2009-10-29 09:54:30] <kwadhwa> brainmc: I would really like to do more in this area, we just don't have the time yet to it. We would either have to staff up or find a better way to work with volunteers in this area. Maybe Pete can take this on ;)

[2009-10-29 09:55:10] <htchien> or maybe Cary ;)

[2009-10-29 09:55:15] <kwadhwa> right!

[2009-10-29 09:55:19] <peteforsyth> kwadhwa: I'm still lost in the woods..you trying to rush me into my first office hours??!

[2009-10-29 09:55:23] <cary> what what what?

[2009-10-29 09:55:29] <htchien> XD

[2009-10-29 09:55:34] <cary> I'm at every office hours

[2009-10-29 09:55:49] <kwadhwa> who says Pete should hit the ground running at full speed! Yah!

[2009-10-29 09:56:06] <cary> me!

[2009-10-29 09:56:10] <Amgine> Nonsense. <overclocks peteforsyth>

[2009-10-29 09:56:15] <peteforsyth> <ducks>

[2009-10-29 09:56:23] <dungodung> :)

[2009-10-29 09:56:38] <cary> he still has to organize recentchangescamp

[2009-10-29 09:56:42] * cary hides

[2009-10-29 09:56:54] <kwadhwa> Just so you know...I am also looking at other ways to extend the brand to other product, etc. It's a delicate brand management area but we plan to do this

[2009-10-29 09:56:57] <peteforsyth> who is this pete of which you speak...

[2009-10-29 09:57:32] <kwadhwa> I think he smells "woodsy"

[2009-10-29 09:58:13] <nihiltres> ouch

[2009-10-29 09:58:16] =-= fschulenburg is now known as fschulenburg|awa

[2009-10-29 09:58:16] <peteforsyth> so Kul, are there any other major areas you're working on that we havein't asked you about?

[2009-10-29 09:58:37] <peteforsyth> I'm feeling Rumsfeldian....

[2009-10-29 09:58:40] <cary> if he told you, he'd have to Kul you

[2009-10-29 09:58:42] <pm75> So Kul you probably know who am i ?

[2009-10-29 09:58:52] <peteforsyth> not knowing the unknown knowns and all

[2009-10-29 10:00:16] <dungodung> we're approaching the end of our meeting

[2009-10-29 10:00:21] <dungodung> are there any more questions?

[2009-10-29 10:00:29] <kwadhwa> product, as I mentioned, is obviously a huge area (it's primarily to drive revenue but it is also meant to market us better). I am also looking into unique content partnerships with media companies. I am trying to figure out revenue models where they would also accept the use of free licenses

[2009-10-29 10:00:42] <kwadhwa> it's quite tricky but that's what the movement is about

[2009-10-29 10:01:09] <kwadhwa> pm75: yes ;)

[2009-10-29 10:01:30] <peteforsyth> Thanks Kul, very interesting session.

[2009-10-29 10:01:47] <htchien> thx for the chat. ;)

[2009-10-29 10:01:48] <Amgine> <nods> Thanks kwadhwa.

[2009-10-29 10:01:51] <kwadhwa> pm75: if you have a good business plan and product developed you should bring it to us

[2009-10-29 10:01:57] <bodnotbod_> Thanks Kul.

[2009-10-29 10:02:30] <kwadhwa> I know it's hard to reach me but I am doing my best

[2009-10-29 10:02:43] <dungodung> kwadhwa: try to hang on IRC as much as possible ;)

[2009-10-29 10:02:53] <kwadhwa> just so you know...I am traveling 25 out of 30 days in the month of November

[2009-10-29 10:03:10] <pm75> Ok kwadhwa I will send you a mail

[2009-10-29 10:03:11] <kwadhwa> dungodung: I actually try to

[2009-10-29 10:03:19] <dungodung> good

[2009-10-29 10:03:21] <htchien> kwadhwa: just remember to read our mails. I will send you one, too. ;)

[2009-10-29 10:03:25] <kwadhwa> pm75: please make sure it's a coherent plan

[2009-10-29 10:03:38] <kwadhwa> if you see me on here...ping me @ anytime

[2009-10-29 10:03:52] <kwadhwa> I am usually stuck in meetings or asleep ;)

[2009-10-29 10:03:53] <cary> We'll have Kul again soon

[2009-10-29 10:04:31] <kwadhwa> I need to track down Jeromyu and get me some Taiwanese tea

[2009-10-29 10:04:57] <kwadhwa> Adios, Tchau, Sayonara

[2009-10-29 10:04:58] <Jeromyu> what?

[2009-10-29 10:05:06] <DarkoNeko> mata ne

[2009-10-29 10:05:07] <Amgine> We call it bubble tea in Canada...

[2009-10-29 10:05:16] <cary> we call it bubble tea here too

[2009-10-29 10:05:58] <DarkoNeko> byes

[2009-10-29 10:06:00] <dungodung> ok, so this is it folks. thanks to Kul for participating and thank you all for joining our session today

[2009-10-29 10:06:10] <kwadhwa> My pleasure

[2009-10-29 10:06:14] <kwadhwa> cheerio!

[2009-10-29 10:06:19] <dungodung> logging off, I guess