Talk:Monuments of Spain Challenge/Participantes

Galandil, al igual que en el reto de Grillito Awards de la wiki en español, todos tus artículos están mal traducidos, mal categorizados -todas las categorías en rojo-, con multitud de faltas ortográficas y enlaces en rojo. Así no se hacen las cosas. Rauletemunoz (talk) 14:20, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Solicito que no se contabilicen los artículos de Galandil que estén marcados en la Galipedia para revisión ortográfica, porque ese trabajo no es correcto ya que no son aportaciones adecuadas para el proyecto. Saludos, --Elisardojm (talk) 23:00, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Espero que alguien tenga a bien investigar la situación de acoso y derribo a la que soy sometido cuando aun estoy trabajando en los artículos de hoy mismo (por desgracia tengo un trabajo de urgencias, y no puedo acabar de hacer los artículos cuando me plazca como parece que le sucede a algunos por estos lares). Galandil (talk) 17:06, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Veo que has rectificado muchos de tus artículos y que les han quitado banners de error. Supongo pues que la cosa se arregló. A mis efectos, lo que las comunidades de cada Wikipedia dejen es lo que vale, y no he detectado que hayan eliminado ningún artículo. Lo dejo al criterio de cada Wikipedia porque en gallego aún entiendo lo que pasa, pero veréis que hay muchas más lenguas que ignoro totalmente y necesito un criterio uniforme. Pero volviendo al tema, no veo que hayan borrado ningún artículo y parece que las indicaciones que habían de errores diversos han desaparecido en buena parte, de lo que me alegro. B25es (talk) 18:07, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Galandil, si estás trabajando en un artículo y no lo puedes terminar lo que debes hacer es poner el modelo En uso (de conocimiento básico de los wikipedistas) para que el resto de usuarios sepan que estás trabajando en el y que no lo vas a dejar así. Nadie te persigue, lo único que se busca en la wikipedia en gallego es tener artículos de calidad, y si contienen errores ortográficos no lo son y así se marcan. B25es, entiendo tu postura pero no estoy de acuerdo con ella, que un artículo se mantenga en una wiki no es síntoma de que sea aceptado ni que tenga un mínimo de calidad. En la Galipedia no se suelen borrar artículos a no ser que sean autotraducciones descaradas, pero eso no indica que los artículos con el aviso de revisión ortográfica sean aceptables, lo que quiere decir es que tienen bastantes errores y que hay que seguir trabajando en ellos. Y quién va a arreglarlos?, el participante en el concurso? y cuándo? antes o después de terminar el concurso? o dentro de un año? No me parece serio, si un artículo tiene problemas en una wiki no debería contabilizarse porque se está añadiendo trabajo a una comunidad que tiene que desviar sus esfuerzos para arreglar los problemas que provoca este concurso, y esto no está bien.

Por otra parte entiendo que esta edición no contemplaba este problema y que ya no es sencillo tenerlo en cuenta, pero espero que para las próximas ediciones se mejore más en este sentido.

Galandil, también te recomendaría, humildemente eso sí, que revisaras todas las correcciones que los usuarios de la Galipedia han tenido que hacer en tus artículos. Quizás así no tengas los mismos problemas en tus nuevos artículos. Eso si, antes de seguir creando nuevos artículos lo mejor sería que revisaras los artículos que has creado y que aún tienen la marca de revisión ortográfica. Saludos, --Elisardojm (talk) 18:28, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

A modo de ayuda para los que tengan ganas y coraje para editar y o crear artículos en la Galipedia.

Casi al segundo siguiente a hacer un artículo ya me habían llegado 2 avisos de mensajes nuevos en mi discusión, uno de bienvenida, y otro dándome a conocer que podía haber errores ortográficos en mis artículos recien creados. De inmediato seguí las recomendaciones (las 2), pues pese a ser gallego, soy consciente de que hay normativa lingüistica que ha podido cambiar, no hablemos ya del léxico que se ha aportuguesado. Pese a ello seguía recibiendo avisos, así que procedí a leerme todas las normativas que habían cambiado así como a revisar que era lo que estaba haciendo mal mirando las modificaciones de otros usuarios en mis artículos, procediendo a ponerlos en práctica. Ahí me llegó un mensaje diciendome que tenía que seguir una estructura "x" para hacer constar que era un artículo traducido de otra wikipedia (cosa que me parecio no solo perfecta, si no que también necesario de hacer de inmediato), pero curiosamente tras poner dicha referenciación al origen de lo traducido, el mismo usuario que me había mandado el mensaje estándar, y pese a que hubiese seguido sus instrucciones al pie de la letra, retiraba mi referenciación pasando a ponerlo en otros lares y de modos distintos a los "estandarizados"; motivo por el cual me harté de ponerlo porque yo lo que no tengo ganas es de perder el tiempo.

Fue entonces cuando empezaron las "triples plantillas", no ya hablando de la parte ortográfica, si no hablando de que el artículo estaba fatal en cuanto a distribución (cuando jamás había recibido ni una de estas plantillas en más de 7 años de usuario, cerca de 5000 creaciones de artículos, y más de 30.000 ediciones); similar al wikificar de la española. Fue entonces cuando me harté de semejante cantidad de errores por mi parte, y le pasé todos los artículos para que me los revisase a un gallego, que vive en Galicia, y es profesor de gallego, procediendo a corregirme cualquier error que pudiese existir, devolviéndome los artículos corregidos, aunque afirmando que solo había unos 20 errores en los artículos mandados, que procedí a corregir, y por ende a retirar la plantilla de marras. En menos de una hora, se me volvió a poner alegando "aun queda mucho que arreglar (Traducido)"; momento en el cual entiendo que solo los veteranos del proyecto tienen la verdad absoluta, y razón por la cual me vuelvo a la española, porque ya me ha quedado muy muy claro que no existe ningún interés en que nadie entre en el terruño, siguiendo de este modo el gobierno caciquil que ha identificado a los gallegos desde tiempos inmemoriales.

Por último si quisiera hacer mención a que soy humano y muchas veces se me olvida poner el interwiki al momento de crear el artículo, llegando a poner el iw de varios artículos. Sin embargo, ante el fanatismo aplantillador de la Galipedia se me ha puesto de inmediato la plantilla, cuando tardaría lo mismo en poner el interwiki; y además ralentizando mis ediciones al obligarme a quitar una plantilla ilógica. Saludos. Galandil (talk) 10:04, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

P.D. Intenté poner las plantillas {{en obras}} y {{en desarrollo}}, pero en la propia previsualización quedó claro que eso no me valía de nada, y dado que suelo trabajar a corto plazo, no me ha parecido que tuviese mayor importancia el no ponerlo. Galandil (talk) 10:10, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Unfair

I am sorry guys but I have to tell the truth. Here is example why this challenge is unfair at the beginning. I suggest that the languages of Spain should have another prizes or you guys can compete each others.

Castell_de_Nogalte, Catalan

Les evidències arqueològiques més antigues de poblament en el turó del castell es remunten a l'edat del bronze en el context històric de la Regió de Múrcia. Durant les diferents campanyes d'excavació que s'han dut a terme en la fortalesa, s'han recuperat materials ceràmics argàrics que permeten establir una ocupació prehistòrica en aquest sector.

Castillo_de_Nogalte, Google translate from Spanish to Catalan

Les evidències arqueològiques més antigues de poblament al' turó del Castell es remunten a l Edat del Bronze. Durant les diferents campanyes d'excavació que s'han dut a terme a la fortalesa, s'han recuperat materials ceràmics argàrics que permeten establir una ocupació prehistòrica en aquest sector.

Oh it looks great. Copy origin text, paste to Google and bingo you get the scores. I am sorry again and again if it makes someones feel uncomfortable, really sorry that. Alphama (talk) 11:10, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

!!?? What is the problem? The correct translation is:

Castell_de_Nogalte, Catalan

Les evidències arqueològiques més antigues de poblament en el turó del castell es remunten a l'edat del bronze en el context històric de la Regió de Múrcia. Durant les diferents campanyes d'excavació que s'han dut a terme en la fortalesa, s'han recuperat materials ceràmics argàrics que permeten establir una ocupació prehistòrica en aquest sector.

The template is transparent:

Template translating Template in the discussion of the article: Translated

And the rules also:

• Se consiguen puntos al mejorar (redactar, expandir, traducir) artículos de Wikipedia. El objetivo de los participantes es conseguir tantos puntos como les sea posible.

• You get points by improving (writing, expanding, translating) Wikipedia articles. Each participant's goal is to gain as many points as possible.
  

What is the problem? Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 14:37, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

PD: Do you really think you can create this article translated is achieved only by pressing a button? Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 14:48, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, you just put more some easy efforts to translate. Just admit it because it's true. For my view, you don't translate it's like you fix grammar.

Here is true translate:

The Museu Picasso (Catalan pronunciation: [muˈzɛw piˈkasu], "Picasso Museum"), located in Barcelona, Spain, houses one of the most extensive collections of artworks by the 20th-century Spanish artist Pablo Picasso => பிகாசோ அருங்காட்சியகம் (மியூசியூ பிகாசோ) என்னும் அருங்காட்சியகம் ஸ்பெயினில் உள்ள பார்செலோனாவில் உள்ளது. இருபதாம் நூற்றாண்டில் வாழ்ந்த பாப்லோ பிக்காசோ என்னும் கலைஞரின் கலை வேலைப்பாடுகளைச் சேகரித்து வைத்துள்ளனர்

Alphama (talk) 17:27, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Maybe your are right about that in other languages. Unfortunately for your information I am a native Catalan, born in Terrassa (Barcelona) and my grammar in Catalan is perfect and so I do all my articles (I'm not using Google Translate for answering you, my wife is helping me as hard as she can, she's improving her english) Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 00:27, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

I am right at languages of Spanish only. There is nothing to be proud of that. I suggest Catalan Wiki shoud use bot to translate automatically from Spanish to Catalan much better, hope somebody can do it. =)) Alphama (talk) 06:36, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Alphama, si hubiese un bot que tradujera correctamente los contenidos de en.wiki al gallego yo pagaría (con una pequeña aportación claro :) al que lo hiciese (aunque ya sería rico al tener un programa que hace traducciones perfectas). No entiendo tu problema la verdad, si un usuario usa el traductor de google y luego revisa y corrige totalmente el resultado, e indica que es una traducción para mantener la licencia..., está perfecto! Tú también puedes hacerlo!! :)

Quieres decir que el traductor de google no hace buenas traducciones a tu idioma? Es posible, pero quizás haya otros traductores que funcionen mejor o que traduzcan mejor de otro idioma que no es el español... De todas formas, esa ventaja que comentas no sólo se da en los idiomas de España, seguramente pasará algo similar con todos los idiomas que derivan del latín porque son lenguas que tienen un origen común, pero en este punto creo que poco podemos hacer porque eso es "simplemente historia". Saludos, --Elisardojm (talk) 07:54, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Me gustaría puntualizar de todas formas que no utilizo el traductor de Google xD. Un saludo. Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 08:47, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Alphama, I participate not for the prizes but because I want to improve Wikipedia. I know that the prizes are a motivation, and there will be ten people awarded. I'm also a Catalan native speaker, and translating from Catalan to Spanish and from Spanish to Catalan is not so easy. If you don't speak both languages you can't translate a long article, the same with other languages like Portuguese, Galician, Italian, etc. If this was so easy every Spanish speaker would translate to every romanic language. I know that you can use google translate or other tools, but I've never used it and it could be also possible with other groups like Russian, Ukranian, Belasurrian, etc. or Serbian, Bosnian, etc. or many others. In Spain people study in colleges how to translate, not only from Spanish to English and viceversa, but also from Spanish to Catalan and from Catalan to Spanish to do it properly. I'm sorry if you think people are using tools in this way but I don't think so. And I want to say thank you to everybody who is working and doing articles in every language. --Millars (talk) 09:00, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

I will not go so far in this discussion because this is just a challenge. The point is I have enough evidences to prove how somebody uses Google Translate to translate from Spanish to Catalan. I understand that is the similarities of languages and is quite popular for human languages. I did suggest the organizer some days ago change the rules but he said he could not when the challenge already run. It's OK but I hope next time organizers should consider carefully and deeply about this case. Although this is just a challenge and I knew many ppl don't care about the prizes but you guys must understand here is WikiMeta where we have lots of editors come from 287 language projects.

This is my first time I join to this challenge at WikiMeta after a very long time lots of editors of my home Wiki did have a nonchalant attitude with this kind of challenge. At last, I am sorry for making a mess. Let continue the challenge and be respect. PS: You guys can use any tools and any means you need. Cheers! Alphama (talk) 10:24, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Retirada

Por las acusaciones y todo lo que estoy viendo que no me parece limpio, me retiro. Suerte a todos :) Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 06:05, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi Spanish, I did not sentence anybody here. What you did it is great for cawiki. I am highly appreciated that you understood the problem. I just pointed out the rules may not be fair for everybody who works very hard and can not follow you even they tried their best. If the prizes divide into two groups: languages of Spanish and other languages and 5 prizes belong to each groups (or whaterver) is much better. I want to see you back to the challenge because I still follow it. Forget it, it's not your fault, my fault or anybody. It looks like a incident when we organize the challenge. We copy another challenge and think, oh it may run well because the previous one was successful.

@All: You guys can hate me because may be I told the truth or I am too straight or I am troublemaker or ..... a lot of cases (even related to HCM) but please don't hate viwiki and Vietnamese. I don't represent for viwiki. Alphama (talk) 08:51, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

Seguiremos, todo sea por el bien de Wikipedia y en mi caso, Viquipèdia. Saludos. Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 21:35, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Some points to be clarified

• This contest is mainly about editing and having fun. Winning isn't really all that important. I'm watching your efforts and I have a general good opinion. In fact such positive view is due to different causes. If I were the mayor of Riópar I would name a square after you, because you've placed that Albaceteña town on the map. The same is true for quite many other places. If only for that, you should be proud of yourselves.
• Points (meaning scoring points): I speak Spanish, Catalan and some English. I can understand Galician and sometimes I have an idea of what's going on in other languages. But I don't know what's exactly happening in, say, Punjabi or Greek or Latvian. So to the final count of points, removals and erasings done but the local Wikipedias will be taken into account.
• What qualifies as a monument? A list was provided: [1]. I've tried to say when I found an article that didn't qualify. Anyway, all articles that you have listed will be checked.
• I take note of everything you're saying, as this contest, while taking many aspects of others, was mainly designed by me. It's my first time. I take note of imperfections as they exist mainly because it is the only way to improve. For now, we've this challenge running as it is. I hope you find Spanish monuments an interesting subject (by the way, I have some 700 articles about Valencian monuments on a word file, being written, so I do find monuments interesting). You are doing great, take it as a game and enjoy it.

B25es (talk) 17:11, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

You changed the rules right? @@Alphama (talk) 01:02, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Alphama Bot

Estas son las contribuciones que ha hecho Alphama (el ser humano) en su primera contribución de sus artículos...

[2]

Y esto es lo que hace Alphama (El Bot) a partir del anterior:

[3]

xDDDDDDDD Amazing, 32.842 bytes!

Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 18:48, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

I use my brain to create this bot and collect the translation rules and it took at least more than 2 weeks to finish. For tools, I created and maintained them more than 1 year. I can run AWB on my account but I don't want to make flood on recent changes. Can I use it? If you want to know in detail, it's complicated. If you want to know, I am quite happy to share you. One more thing I don't think you have ability to know this kind of technique. If you can, have a look at my page [4] PS: Everyone at viwiki can have ability to use AWB and bots very well my friend. We even have a training program for it. That's why we have 1M articles although I don't expect this much. What can you say if I delete that article and create new version here vi:Danh sách di sản văn hóa Tây Ban Nha được quan tâm ở thành phố Ceuta. Do I need to do that with all my lists? =)) Alphama (talk) 21:03, 31 October 2014 (UTC) Alphama (talk) 20:25, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

Alphama i really dont appreciate the fact that you added all the articles on the last day. You should have had courage to compete boldly. This way you have won. Congratulations. But i am really disappointed at this approach. And creating lists with automated translation machine isnt as productive as creating real articles. Well this was easy for you as you said you have used you brains. --Satdeep gill (talk) 23:20, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

The way you copy to Google Translate then paste them and create those 2 lists, then replace parameters (even in Spanish not in your language) for me it's a garbage. You don't translate at all and to translate more difficult than you thought. And more, normally your article content is just like this [5], 659 bytes and no more but you create hundred articles (same references, sources, ...). I observed 3 weeks ago but I did not say anything. I let you enjoy that. You made a bunch of garbage in some those Wikis already. What I did is to translate as much as I can in everything single list, use Vietnamese parameters, correct images, and make articles aesthetically. I complied to the rules and what else can I do for you? You think it is easy to create a bot, OK go and learn some programming language courses. Do you think everything can work automatically without human? Here is my first articles vi:Danh sách di sản văn hóa Tây Ban Nha được quan tâm ở tỉnh Zaragoza, I did more than 51 edits in one day just to scan the rules. Ah yes, I forgot that you copy English Wikipedia content and paste them directly to simple Wiki such as [6], [7]. Oh sb copied and received the scores. Great.. The way you did I also don't appreciate that. For me, I respect this guy [8] more than anybody in this competition. Alphama (talk) 01:17, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Hehe. There was no more content about them in English. What was i supposed to do. But yeah whatever i was doing i made it sure to add all my points here in the contest daily. Wiki is about transperancy and not about hiding your cards for the last moment. While you knew what i was doing and how many points i had. Didnt i deserve to know that about you ?--Satdeep gill (talk) 04:21, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Change the rules and you can see my score. Btw, I feel very sorry for readers when they read this [9], they even can not find any source helpful. You think for youself just win the competition and higher than sb else not for Wikis. Luckily, it's not viwiki. If you did these things at viwiki, honestly your account will be ban or at least you may get some serious alerts. Alphama (talk) 05:40, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

en:Iglesia de Santa María (Monasterio de Hermo) This is the article in English. If there is a stub about this on English wiki then Hindi Wiki can also have it. Articles on Wiki are dynamic. They don't get written once and finished. What do you expect from me? Well anyways u should have added your points daily so that everyone knew what you were doing. Whatever you did was a trick so that no one can create those 50 points lists at the end moment. Well i know there are many stubs but i have created many meaningful articles as well which takes a lot more effort than the lists. If i knew you are going to get these many points by lists only, then i would have spent all the time on creating lists purely in Punjabi(With all the templates and keeping aesthetics in mind). But at this moment lists were not as important as creating articles which tell us something about the monument like pa:ਕਾਸਾ ਵਿਸੇਂਸ and pa:ਗੌਦੀ ਘਰ-ਅਜਾਇਬਘਰ. You should also know that i didn't start creating those one line articles. But once other editors started doing it then i had to do it to keep up with them. --Satdeep gill (talk) 06:42, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

No no I did not mention about stub. However, Oh, great, but stub article with a sentence like: pa:ਸਾਨ ਨਿਕੋਲਾਸ ਗਿਰਜਾਘਰ (ਬੀਯੋਰੀਆ) ABC is a church in Spain That's all? nonsense. Even you can not add the place Asturias. I mentioned about the way you (some others) used the same exterlinks for all articles. Normallly, your article just is 6xx bytes (mean 0 + 1 points) but by this way you can increase (3 + 1 points). When readers clicked on these links, they can not get the information they want then, man. Before sentencing sb, look yourself at the mirror. Now, go and do sth more meaningful instead of being here and yelling the old story. I said that I complied to the rules which are part of the game. That's all. Alphama (talk) 11:15, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

First of all hire someone to read, it is written ABC is a church in Asturias, Spain. Don't you worry because I am doing a lot of other things. But it was a great experience, i learned a lot. Thanks to you. --Satdeep gill (talk) 11:30, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Me too, I learned how to copy from enwiki to simplewiki and how to use the same references & external links from you. Thanks for that. Alphama (talk) 11:35, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

It is my pleasure. I know you have done real hard work. Kudos for that. I on the other hand didnt do much effort. But i would have appreciated you more had you added your points daily. So that others could have learned from you. You should have taught me to make better articles. I am still a learner. You on the other hand are very experienced. Can we be friends on facebook ? My profile name is Satdeep Gill. I guess i can learn a lot from you and then improve Indian Wiki Projects.--Satdeep gill (talk) 14:28, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Lo más gracioso es que Alphama se quejaba de mí porque decía que mis traducciones eran automáticas xD. Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 08:09, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

I did told B25es know about that problem but he did not listen to me. At the begining, I saw a lot of problems. I said that the competition is much better if we divive prizes into 2 groups (language of Spain and others). He said that he could not change the rule. OK, then I told you that you used Google Translate and pay less efforts but you also did not listen to me and bla bla with me although I have enough evidences (sb even mentioned about Vietnamese language and HCM which are not related?). Then, I said it's OK, I am sorry for making mess. You can do anything and use any tools and I called you back to the competition, right. Now, I am quite please to give you two a lesson because you two don't listen to me. That's the problem. When I created the first lists, suddenly B25es change the rule even though before he said that he could not change any rules. For me, it's OK and I know he thought I am black ship already. OK OK, he can change anything, I accept all. With B25es this is his first time, so am I. Next time, pls listen to somebody because they give suggestions not just for fun. Alphama (talk) 08:28, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

A few observations

• First of all, hearty congratulations to Alphama.
• As regards to his article-creating/ list-creating strategy, I wonder if it is as good as or superior to the strategy adopted by Punjabi Wikipedia admin Vigyani which I wrote in one of my Wikimedia blogposts.
• Time to time disclosure of one's edits is more of a norm then a compulsion by any rule.No last minute update will result in any adverse effect on the winnability of any candidate.
• Spinning articles v/s Lengthy articles: I am new to these type of editathons. I've found that creating short articles resulting in points such as 1+2, 1+3, etc are gainful then writing or expanding lengthy articles such as hi: भूमध्य सागर के आईबीरियाई बेसन की प्रसिद्ध पत्थर की कला and hi: सग्रादा फैमिलिया which consume 4-5 hours and give a pittance in terms of points.
• This editathon was also a competition of technology (bot) v/s multilingual editing, and I guess technology superseded linguistic jugglery.
• There was a strategy and copy-cat culture here: my article hi:नासिरी महल found a place on Punjabi Wikipedia in less than 14 hours. On the other hand I easily created a Hindi list-article in Maithili and a few other languages because I was involved with communities since the past some time. As against this, a simple list of external links section pertaining to Church architecture in Spain I used in some articles was copied and extensively used by two participants in about a hundred articles+ in Punjabi and Hindi - letting them gain more weightage than me - the creator of this list.
• My experience with Simple English was good, except in the case of one article, although my edits on that Wiki did not extend beyond 4-5 articles. --Muzammil (talk) 08:12, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

I think that everybody of us have learned from this experience. One of the most open challenges or writing contest in everylanguage. I hope we could collect many information to improve this kind of experiences and I hope that nobody will become angry. This is only a way to improve Wikipedia. Many people have worked a lot, I'm very impressed. Congratulations. As I know, B25es is checking all articles to give a result as fair as possible. I edited in 9 languages, and I created my firts articles in Aragonese, Occitan, Portuguese or English. This was also a good experience for me. About the lists, in the begining the idea was that only articles linked in the lists could be acpeted, but the organization accepted to let people create lists, but with 1/3 of the points. This was because a list provides more kb than an article without information, only wikicode. I hope everybody could understand that. Regards. --Millars (talk) 22:19, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

I think that one of the most rewarding aspect of this editathon has been the barnstar and the Facebook-style of likes I got for the articles I created on the article talk pages: 1, 2 and 3. --Muzammil (talk) 19:21, 4 November 2014 (UTC)

Opportunity for improvement

Hi guys, I'd like to propose, for next editions of this contest, to use rules similar to those of Did You Know in the English Wikipedia. In particular Articles must have a minimum of 1,500 characters of prose (ignoring infoboxes, categories, references, lists, and tables etc.)' That way, artificial inflation of articles by including lots and lots of wikitext. To give you an example: vi:Danh sách di sản văn hóa Tây Ban Nha được quan tâm ở Mallorca includes 1200 bytes of template tags with no actual content (the same trick can be seen in vi:Santa_María_Magdalena,_Zaragoza; if you remove unused wikitext, the article goes down from 4084 bytes to 2943), is wrongly named, includes untranslated text, provides just a link that does not work and have less than 2000 bytes in actual length. I can't understand how such an article counts at all and I guess all the lists included show the same issues. Another example: vi:Santa_María_Magdalena,_Zaragoza: no more than 500 bytes of actual text. Best regards --Devo Max (talk) 00:28, 8 November 2014 (UTC) PS: BTW, could it be possible to analyze all Alphama's contributions, remove superfluous wikitext and text in languages other that the one of the wikipedia where the article is and provide a new result?

Sure, but to be fair, can you do it for all competitors, OK? Alphama (talk) 11:39, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Totally agree with two propositions for this event and events futurs Rauletemunoz ^{You talking to me?} 11:10, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Check this and [10] and [11] also. The same refs and external links for ALL articles. Don't sentence me when everybody did the same things. Alphama (talk) 11:32, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

And no simple wiki also. Alphama (talk) 11:38, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Some summary:

1. Articles must comply to CC-CY-SA license terms. If any of the new articles or expansions is a translations, the proper attribution and source must be provided, either in the history or in the talk page.
2. Proper wikilinks through wikidata must be in place.
3. Only actual text is used to get scores. Wikitext is not used for scoring.
4. List are only given one (1) point. It would promote actual content creation and no mere wikitext cut and paste.
5. No text in other languages than the one of the given wikipedia are allowed.

Other suggestions are welcome. --Devo Max (talk) 23:08, 12 November 2014 (UTC)

Alphama's editions

Hi all, just out of curiosity I've begun to analyze Alphama's editions. I've found a number of issues that should make the organizers think what the purpose of the challenge is and the parameters under which it should be carried out:

• Systematic violation of the CC-BY-SA license terms. Alphama has created dozens of lists that are simply a translation of articles in other wikipedias. As such, they're derivative works and therefore, must acknowledge they're a translation and clearly state what the source is. Otherwise it's simply plagiarism. Can be the winner of this contest a wikipedist that has bleached systematically our own license terms?
• Inclusion of empty parameters in wiki templates so that articles are 20% or 30% longer. See some examples:
  • vi:Danh sách di sản văn hóa Tây Ban Nha được quan tâm ở Montuïri: this: 1236 bytes trimmed (out of 6932, as about 700 bytes were bot made).
  • vi:Nhà thờ chính tòa Las Palmas: this (1333 bytes trimmed out of 3214 bytes; not only a lot of empty template fields but a huge number of links that are not related at all to this cathedral)
  • vi:Nhà thờ chính tòa Almería: 1156 bytes trimmed out of 3210.
  • vi:Nhà thờ chính tòa Almudena: 1049 bytes trimmed out of 5362 (this)
• Editions made by a bot that are actually included as regular editions (see here)
• Lists that aren't actually a list of monuments (for instance vi:Nhà thờ chính tòa ở Tây Ban Nha, sorry but being a cathedral does not mean being a monument, especially if you consider non-Catholic cathedrals; vi:Danh sách thư viện ở Tây Ban Nha, same comment with regard to libraries; vi:Danh sách ngọn hải đăng ở Tây Ban Nha, same comment with regard to lighthouses).
• Articles not belonging to monuments:
  • vi:Bien de Interés Cultural
  • vi:Monte Perdido
  • vi:Vall de Boí
  • vi:Ibiza (more than 4000 bytes copied verbatim from statistics in the English Wikipedia, as usual without attribution)
• Wrong naming: vi:Danh sách di sản văn hóa Tây Ban Nha được quan tâm ở Mallorca, where it does not refer explicitly to Mallorca, but to Montuiri.
• Articles keeping text in Spanish. Some examples:
  • vi:Danh sách di sản văn hóa Tây Ban Nha được quan tâm ở thành phố Madrid ("Arquitecto", Datos obtenidos de la página de patrimonio del Ministerio de Cultura. Sección "bienes culturales protegidos"-"consulta de bienesi nmuebles... the link does not even work and haven't been fixed)
  • vi:Nhà thờ chính tòa Ciudad Rodrigo: Página web de la Catedral; Información y fotografías sobre la Catedral de Santa María de Ciudad Rodrigo en turismociudadrodrigo.com; Información sobre horarios de visita y precio de entrada; Datos y fotografías de la catedral en ciudadrodrigo.net; Hernández Vegas, Mateo. Ciudad Rodrigo. La Catedral y la Ciudad. Tomo 1. Texto íntegro. Edición digital de Carlos Muñoz-Caravaca.
  • vi:Nhà thờ chính tòa Sigüenza: the template 'Cita libro' (from the Spanish Wikipedia) has not been even translated.

My conclusion? I don't think this is the kind of contributions a serious contest requires (not to talk about the his childish reaction (see here). --Devo Max (talk) 11:43, 9 November 2014 (UTC)

You are so good and nice https://es.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Casa_Palazuelo&diff=prev&oldid=78039823. If you deleted my edits, have a look at other competitors. You came to viwiki and you deleted parameters without any discussion on many articles. When sb wanted to discuss you kept silent. That's why. If you want to count bytes, count by yoursefl, don't count by removing data, parameters are helped for future editors. I gave the reason already. Alphama (talk) 11:26, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Systematic violation of the CC-BY-SA license terms. Alphama has created dozens of lists that are simply a translation of articles in other wikipedias. As such, they're derivative works and therefore, must acknowledge they're a translation and clearly state what the source is. Otherwise it's simply plagiarism. Can be the winner of this contest a wikipedist that has bleached systematically our own license terms? <-- This is a Spanish challenge but sb said NO, don't touch eswiki, don't use Spain resources (a kind of open and free resources) so how can we contribute. Alphama (talk) 11:58, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

I don't think you understand at all what CC-BYSA means. It is NOT public domain. It's a free license that requires, among other conditions, to attribute the source and acknowledge its authorship. It's usually done by means of templates in the article's talk page (example) or by explicit acknowledge in the article's history (through the comments in the initial edition). Otherwise it's plagiarism. --Devo Max (talk) 23:34, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Simply insert a header template which says "This article is translated from Spanish Wikipedia". Is it OK with you and CC-BY? Why you aim only me when other competitors also did that? Hmm what's wrong with you? Show me evidences why Spanish templates and articles comply to CC-BY. I translated from English and copy these parameters, it's weird when you denied them. Really weird, you want to reduce my score, sure, but is it necessary to do that? Alphama (talk) 23:38, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

The best proof of good faith would have been you fix all the issues I've addressed above. It hasn't happened. I assume that you're much more interested in complaining (and in winning the contest at any prize), that in actually adhering to the contest principles... sadly the ends don't justify the means. --Devo Max (talk) 23:03, 12 November 2014 (UTC)